Hmmm... I really, really hope the KC cameras actually take an identifiable photograph of the driver.

I would hate to get points against my license as well as a ticket just because one of my bone-headed relatives/kids borrowed my car without my permission & then ran a light.

my understanding is that no points are assessed against your license.  it's sort of like a parking ticket for a moving violation.

Do people usually borrow your car without permission? Had another weird thing happen with these. My wife got a ticket in the mail from a camera in DC. Apparently when she dropped her Illinois license plates...they gave the number to someone else (or it was a fake plate). But she was mailed a ticket from a city she didn't visit, in a car she didn't own, with a picture of license plate that used to be hers.

Called and reported it to State of Illinois. They told us to forget it ever happened. Maybe someone got an ass-chewing.

exactly, it's a non moving violation.

I have no problem with the cameras.  I drive very aggressively and pretty much can't stand the way people in KC drive.  They drive slow, yet dangerous and oblivious to what’s going on around them.

But one thing I don't do is run red lights.  I have however been nearly tboned a few times by people.

The day they ticket people for driving slow in the left lanes and ticket people for not getting up to speed when merging onto interstates will be a great day.  Those are the same people that don't give pedestrians the right of way in urban areas.

The KC City Council specifically required the vendor to guarantee that the cameras did not take photos of anyone's face, only the plates and the car from above. 

I have no sympathy for people complaining about getting a ticket for someone else driving their car.  Cars are lethal weapons and their owners should be responsible for whom they lend them to.  If you can't trust the people using your car to obey the law, or can't keep track of who is using it - then you have bigger issues than a traffic ticket.

The burden of proof should be on the entity issuing the ticket. If it can't be proven that I was the one driving my car, then I have a problem with paying the ticket. Interesting that this is treated as a non-moving violation though, which is further proof that this whole thing is nothing more than a revenue grab.

And I'll take this opportunity to admit that I run 10-15 traffic lights per weekend in downtown KC when there's nobody around. After making a complete stop and checking for traffic of course! Ooogaboogabooga!

Agreed on all counts.  My sense is that the sort of tickets generated by these cameras are not the blatant red light running but the slightly-late-on-a-yellow type.  Or say you're making a left turn and by the time oncoming traffic has cleared at the light change, your light is barely red.

The number of flagrant red light violations I see is so rare that I can't believe they alone warrant the cameras.  Not to mention, it seems highly unlikely that those boneheads would be deterred by a camera.

Is red light running really an issue of problematic proportion?  I know plenty of people who drive above the speed limit, for example, knowing the consequences full well and accepting them if called on it.  I know no one who wantonly runs red lights.

I really don't think this is about safety.  It's far more likely this is about revenue generation for the city - or that is their hope.  After they realize all the maintenance needed after a few years, there's no certainty it will pay off.

Yeah, I agree, but posts by dangerboy and GRID suggest that there is a notable safety component.

DC seems to have a bad habit of thinking they can inforce every other state's license laws.  I had a buddy get a ticket there once for parking with an "expired vehicle inspection" because the local meter maid didn't know how to read the MO inspection sticker but damn well thought she knew enough to write a ticket.  He had a fun time fighting that one - had to get a letter from hislocal license office. 

Don't count on the city being fair and on your side. My wife just got a parking ticket while legally parked on Oak by the Nelson. You can't fight city hall.

Some stats that have been published on the first 39th/SW Trafficway camera...  800 violations photographed during the 30 day grace period.  900 violations during the first 60 days of real operations - an almost 50% decline once the cameras went live.

Also, the cameras can be moved around to different locations as red light running goes up or down and specific intersections.

This reminds me of something that happened to me a few years ago:

I got a letter in the mail saying that there was a warrant out for my arrest for not appearing in court for a parking violation I got in St. Louis.  Only I hadn't been to St. Louis at all that year.  So, I called the city of St. Louis and pretty much said, "WTF?"  I guess some cop in St Louis wrote a ticket for car that was illegally parked, and somehow my license plate number what the number that was entered.  It didn't help that it was the same make and model as my car.  Of course, it had different VIN and it was different color. 

In the end, I had to go to court in St. Louis to prove that it wasn't my car, only to have them say, "We're sorry.  Our bad."   I went all the way to St. Louis for that!    I sure hope no cop in Japan mistakenly writes down my license plate number!

^The bill also bans texting just for young drivers?  I'm much more concerned about car swerving than red light runners.  The only time running a red light runner is truly dangerous is if cars in opposite direction are in motion.  Still potentially dangerous but older adults texting while driving is likely far more dangerous.

BTW, most cameras are front plate shots and can be easily avoided by simply removing your front plate.  My front plate was stolen and had no idea for how long.  Could've been days or months - no idea.

^Red light cameras have proven to sharply reduce t-bone collisions, which are the most common and most dangerous.  They have a proven reduction in death and serious injuries.  The KC cameras take front and rear plate shots.

Cite.

I've read that they can increase sudden-stop/rear-end accidents.

And the KC cameras take front, back and video. If anyone would like to see me turning right on a red light w/out coming to a complete stop, just let me know. The video is online...

Do I still need to pay my ticket now that they've been banned?

They do increase rear-end collisions slightly, these are much less destructive to life and property than the t-bone collisions that kill and disable people.  So we exchange one type of deadly and costly wrecks for another type that is much less serious.

Still waiting for that cite. I've looked into this pretty extensively and haven't found dramatic decreases in T-boning accidents. Why? Research says: because ~99% of the time, someone who runs a red light and T-bones you wasn't paying attention. They didn't run the red light, at full speed, on purpose, just to flaunt the law or to be assholes. Rather, they were messing around with the radio, trying to put out a cigarette they dropped, or texting their boyfriend. They didn't even know the light was red. They may not have even realized they were at an intersection. How is a camera going to fix that? Answer: it won't. All it really does is stop people from gunning it through yellow lights, which isn't a T-bone threat.