Generic ongoing KCATA thread

[SilentSpades24]

Worth noting, KCMO did not fully cover the KCATA budget. Either deep cuts inbound or fares will be returning.

Also, KCK getting a reworked transit network, but they too are facing cuts.

Fares making a comeback then? Fare free transit doesn’t really remove any barriers to entry if routes are cut and headways remain what they are or increase.

I think fares have to comeback if there's any chance to maintain the service we have now (which is like maybe 1/2 of what we had in 2019).

[KCPowercat]

How much longer can the 18x route hold on. I swear I d never seen one person on that bus. it seems like it should be useful though.

[Cratedigger]

How much longer can the 18x route hold on. I swear I d never seen one person on that bus. it seems like it should be useful though.

Weirdly ATA doesn't report on the ridership numbers for that route...?

https://ridekc.org/planning/dashboard

[DaveKCMO]

How much longer can the 18x route hold on. I swear I d never seen one person on that bus. it seems like it should be useful though.

It will last as long as the city wants it to.

[GRID]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yPv8DpliNp4

So I guess the KCATA is not moving anytime soon. Video mentions they are doing improvements in 2025. I thought they were going to sell that property and move to a larger facility and free up the land for a more appropriate use to help tie the Jazz District to the Crossroads. At one time, I think it was a considered site for the Royals.

[langosta]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yPv8DpliNp4

So I guess the KCATA is not moving anytime soon. Video mentions they are doing improvements in 2025. I thought they were going to sell that property and move to a larger facility and free up the land for a more appropriate use to help tie the Jazz District to the Crossroads. At one time, I think it was a considered site for the Royals.

Was the plan when they were gun-ho about TOD development. KCATA has for the most part stopped with the incentive and development programs bowing to pressure from groups with names that are familiar to all

[DaveKCMO]

You can transfer the federal interest to another site. I was part of the team that planned these improvements. Not an impediment!

[GRID]

You can transfer the federal interest to another site. I was part of the team that planned these improvements. Not an impediment!

So this site is still on the table for a ballpark?

Again, I always though the KCATA needed to move from that location. They say it's a reason the agency can't even have articulated buses. Plus KC has one of the smallest bus systems for a city it's size and I would think the KCATA would like to change that someday.

[langosta]

You can transfer the federal interest to another site. I was part of the team that planned these improvements. Not an impediment!

So this site is still on the table for a ballpark?

Again, I always though the KCATA needed to move from that location. They say it's a reason the agency can't even have articulated buses. Plus KC has one of the smallest bus systems for a city it's size and I would think the KCATA would like to change that someday.

I wonder if the NE Bottoms are a better location

[DaveKCMO]

Haven't worked there in two years, so no idea what the latest conversation is but the city had interest in doing something with the site and it was offered in tandem with the school. No reason to think the agency's position has changed much, but they would need funding to acquire and build at a new site. They definitely don't have that sitting in the bank and the city grabbed all of the COVID relief for LED streetlights, so...

Artics could be supported on the current site, but no one is planning for that improvement and honestly I'd rather have more frequency that bendybois. It would be expensive, but the bus barn will need a major overhaul at some point (as will the "service line" -- how the buses are serviced through various functions like washing and fueling).

[Metro]

I read there are in the red by 22 million dollars. Heads have to roll right?

[chingon]

The apple of incompetence and minor celebrity doesn't fall far from the tree.

[GRID]

Correct me if I am wrong, but it seems like the quality and service of the KCATA bus system has fallen quite a bit since they made it free. I predicted it would happen. Nothing good comes from making a transit system free to use which is why there are pretty much no large high quality, high use transit systems in the world that are free to use.

[langosta]

Correct me if I am wrong, but it seems like the quality and service of the KCATA bus system has fallen quite a bit since they made it free. I predicted it would happen. Nothing good comes from making a transit system free to use which is why there are pretty much no large high quality, high use transit systems in the world that are free to use.

Net revenue on fares was low millions

[KCPowercat]

Correct me if I am wrong, but it seems like the quality and service of the KCATA bus system has fallen quite a bit since they made it free. I predicted it would happen. Nothing good comes from making a transit system free to use which is why there are pretty much no large high quality, high use transit systems in the world that are free to use.

I'm not a daily rider but I use it more now that it is free and I don't think I'd say it's fallen in service? I'd never say it was high quality service though. I mean the city pulling it's funding amount is probably going to force it to collect fares again but not sure how making transit free is "nothing good" coming from it? Puts some money back in pockets for those who need it and rely on transit for their jobs?

[GRID]

Correct me if I am wrong, but it seems like the quality and service of the KCATA bus system has fallen quite a bit since they made it free. I predicted it would happen. Nothing good comes from making a transit system free to use which is why there are pretty much no large high quality, high use transit systems in the world that are free to use.

Net revenue on fares was low millions

Doesn't matter. You are taking an already small bus system and removing an existing and future revenue source, especially from a transit system that gets almost no state or county funding.

You also encourage more people to camp out on the system (homeless etc) which discourages people that do have options from riding the buses.

People will pay to use a system that works KCATA is a barely functioning bus system for a city the size of KC and if these cuts go through, they may as well just shut it down and start over.

Get regional and state funding (which will trigger more fed funding) and build something decent that people can use. Been "talking" about doing that now for decades.

As a person that grew up riding KC buses, what has happened to KC's bus system is pretty incredible. I know they have the max lines now. (which are not BRT at all, but closer to what normal city bus routes should be like). Even before the max lines, there were so many more bus routes and frequencies, that buses still came quicker on streets like Troost.

If KC is serious about stuff like a downtown stadium and expanding the streetcar, it has got to figure out how to properly fund, build and run a usable bus system. Making it free was a step in the wrong direction.

[GRID]

Correct me if I am wrong, but it seems like the quality and service of the KCATA bus system has fallen quite a bit since they made it free. I predicted it would happen. Nothing good comes from making a transit system free to use which is why there are pretty much no large high quality, high use transit systems in the world that are free to use.

I'm not a daily rider but I use it more now that it is free and I don't think I'd say it's fallen in service? I'd never say it was high quality service though. I mean the city pulling it's funding amount is probably going to force it to collect fares again but not sure how making transit free is "nothing good" coming from it? Puts some money back in pockets for those who need it and rely on transit for their jobs?

Because the ATA is already so underfunded as it is. Taking a system that is just scraping to get by and making it free is not going to help it.

[TheLastGentleman]

You also encourage more people to camp out on the system (homeless etc) which discourages people that do have options from riding the buses.

There it is

[GRID]

You also encourage more people to camp out on the system (homeless etc) which discourages people that do have options from riding the buses.

There it is

Well it's exaggerated even more in a city like KC where so few people ride buses. If you are on a bus with 50 other people and there is a some drugged out guy or something on the bus it's easier to look past it.

But if every time you step on a bus, you around people like that more than "normal" people, you will likely stop riding the bus.

I'm sorry, but that's just the way it is. I ride transit in cities all over the country and world and am very much a transit advocate in general. American transit systems and cities have enough problems. Making transit free is not likely to improve anything and more likely to just make things worse, again especially in a city like KC that doesn't have things like transit police etc. You are telling people that bus is for the ultra poor. in a country where people are already not into riding buses because it's beneath most people here. Right or wrong it is what it is.

[GRID]

This is KC's transit problem, no funding from the state. But KC is not like Denver (Colorado also doesn't fund transit much), but Denver has a regional transit sales tax collected across multiple counties. KCATA does not even have a single county wide tax, but relies only on each individual city. (JoCo may fund their buses at the county level, a very low level of course).